TWL
 Granny Gear Posts:42

 Registered Users
 |
| 05/14/2008 4:30 PM |
|
| One identity is for my good angel. The other is for my bad angel. They argue all the time. I wish they'd stop it. The voices, the voices.... |
|
|
|
|
Rowbear
 Big Ring Posts:186

 Registered Users Lexington, KY
 |
| 05/14/2008 5:33 PM |
|
Posted By Tonybob on 05/14/2008 4:02 PM If there had been no 9/11 he wouldn't have won a second term.
Thats a little far-reaching (but prolly not far off). I mean, who knows what other events could have happened and or shaped those 4 years.
yeah, we probably would've went to war with Iraq anyway it's not like there was any proof that they were involved in 9/11 or that they had weapons of mass destruction
|
|
|
|
|
Tonybob
 Big Ring Posts:220

 Registered Users
 |
| 05/14/2008 5:44 PM |
|
| I'm just saying the war has been his biggest sore spot in the polls, so if 9/11 hadnt happened, it's hard to say what would have defined the administration, good or bad, war or none. thats all. now go back to your hippie college campus weed party. |
|
|
|
|
G-MAN
 Big Ring Posts:148

 Registered Users Louisville, KY
 |
| 05/14/2008 7:19 PM |
|
Posted By Rowbear on 05/14/2008 5:33 PM Posted By Tonybob on 05/14/2008 4:02 PM If there had been no 9/11 he wouldn't have won a second term.
Thats a little far-reaching (but prolly not far off). I mean, who knows what other events could have happened and or shaped those 4 years.
yeah, we probably would've went to war with Iraq anyway it's not like there was any proof that they were involved in 9/11 or that they had weapons of mass destruction
Yeah, what Rowbear said,
Everyone knows that Bush is evil and would've bombed Iraq and Afganistan eventually. Hell, I'm surprised he hasn't bombed any other countries yet.
|
|
|
|
|
the weak link
 Granny Gear Posts:31

 Registered Users
 |
| 05/14/2008 7:57 PM |
|
He needs to bomb Sudan. Oops, clinton did that already. He needs to bomb Serbia. Oops, clinton did that too. He bombed Iraq because the impeachment hearing didn't drag on long enough for Clinton to keep bombint them, too. |
|
|
|
|
E-Ski-Wee-Ski
 Granny Gear Posts:29

 Registered Users PRP
 |
|
FireBallKY
 Big Ring Posts:116

 Registered Users Lexington, KY USA
 |
| 05/15/2008 7:20 PM |
|
What the heck was that? One of those guys kinda looked like PR. :) |
|
I'm not fat. That's a fuel tank for the love machine!!! |
|
|
G-MAN
 Big Ring Posts:148

 Registered Users Louisville, KY
 |
| 05/15/2008 7:29 PM |
|
Posted By Boonerider on 05/11/2008 7:58 PM Posted By PR on 05/11/2008 1:33 PM You know guys, I'm not really an Obama man. But I'll tell you what; I'll take Obama, or Creep, or TWL, or just about anybody off the street. I'll take my chances, cause whoever it is won't be nearly as big a screw up as the one we've had in the past eight years. That's my vote for change. And I'm voting. There you go, my thoughts exactly! Anyone would be a welcome change after the idiot we've lived through for the past 8 long years
I'm glad that Bush stole the election...just think of the alternative...GORE...Oh the humanity...
|
|
|
|
|
creeping death
 Big Ring Posts:108

 Registered Users
 |
| 05/15/2008 8:24 PM |
|
| If Oboma was a white male. Would people look at him as a change/ new hope? I think he would be put in the same category as the other candidates. Many voters are for Oboma for his public image, not his policies or values. If he wasn't running for president how strongly would he denounce Rev. Wright? |
|
|
|
|
OCguy
 Little Ring Posts:94

 Registered Users Oldham
 |
| 05/15/2008 10:13 PM |
|
| I can't figure out what's gonna change if he is elected. I have not heard one proposal (solid or squishy) out of Obamamama. Just a bunch of "change". |
|
|
|
|
creeping death
 Big Ring Posts:108

 Registered Users
 |
| 05/15/2008 11:41 PM |
|
He will change.................I have no clue..........................still wondering. |
|
|
|
|
G-MAN
 Big Ring Posts:148

 Registered Users Louisville, KY
 |
| 05/16/2008 8:16 AM |
|
Posted By OCguy on 05/15/2008 10:13 PM I can't figure out what's gonna change if he is elected. I have not heard one proposal (solid or squishy) out of Obamamama. Just a bunch of "change". But he says it so well...one thing's for sure...we'll see a lot more of the nonsense that's going on in California spreading across our land.
|
|
|
|
|
PR
 Big Ring Posts:172

 Registered Users Jackson County
 |
| 05/16/2008 8:26 AM |
|
Posted By FireBallKY on 05/15/2008 7:20 PM
What the heck was that? One of those guys kinda looked like PR. :)
That was around the fire at the Turkeybuster last year. Me and Creep were warming up before the race. |
|
|
|
|
OCguy
 Little Ring Posts:94

 Registered Users Oldham
 |
| 05/16/2008 9:34 AM |
|
Posted By G-MAN on 05/16/2008 8:16 AM Posted By OCguy on 05/15/2008 10:13 PM I can't figure out what's gonna change if he is elected. I have not heard one proposal (solid or squishy) out of Obamamama. Just a bunch of "change". But he says it so well...one thing's for sure...we'll see a lot more of the nonsense that's going on in California spreading across our land.
It's a bit strange, but Obama reminds me of (Bill) Clinton--smooth talker with no substance--while Mrs. Clinton reminds me of, gulp, Richard Nixon. A "my way or the highway" attitude is what I perceive.
Not that it matters too much. War and Judges, War and Judges.
|
|
|
|
|
Big Tommy C
 Little Ring Posts:63

 Registered Users
 |
| 05/16/2008 11:48 PM |
|
Posted By Rod on 05/14/2008 1:57 PM
A recent book called G. W. the biggest white collar criminal ever after he stole the first election. He has signed more than 800 signing statements more than all presidents combined. There will be a lot of books written about this administration and that's me stating it as nicely as possible.
I still don't see how it is that Bush "stole the election" when every time the votes were counted, he won, except if they went the way Gore was telling them to and threw out all the military ballots, then said that every vote was for Gore no matter how the ballot was actually marked, because they were trying to make the case that Floridians are too idiotic to understand a simple ballot. Yeah, Bush stole the election.
Iraq? How is it that peoples' memories are so short that they can't remember what was said before the war?
You may remember that all 15 intelligence agencies the US depends on were making the statement that Iraq had WMDs.
Not enough? How about Britain, Germany, Russia, China, Israel and even France? ALL of them were convinced Iraq had WMDs, there just wasn't agreement to act on it.
Another name? Hans Blix. This is from a few months before the invasion:
The discovery of a number of 122-mm chemical rocket
warheads in a bunker at a storage depot 170 km miles] southwest
of Baghdad was much publicized. This was a relatively new bunker, and
therefore the rockets must have been moved there in the past few
years, at a time when Iraq should not have had such munitions. . . .
They could also be the tip of a submerged iceberg. The discovery of a
few rockets does not resolve but rather points to the issue of
several thousands of chemical rockets that are unaccounted for.
Hmmm, yeah, obviously Bush was making the whole thing up.
Kenneth Pollack, served on the National Security Council under Clinton, writing in Spring 2002:
I participated in a Washington meeting about Iraqi WMD.
Those present included nearly twenty former inspectors from the
United Nations Special Commission (UNSCOM), the force established in
1991 to oversee the elimination of WMD in Iraq. One of the senior
people put a question to the group: did anyone in the room doubt that
Iraq was currently operating a secret centrifuge plant? No one did.
Three people added that they believed Iraq was also operating a
secret calutron plant (a facility for separating uranium isotopes).
Here is Bill Clinton himself, speaking
in 1998:
If Saddam rejects peace and we have to use force, our
purpose is clear. We want to seriously diminish the threat posed by
Iraq's weapons-of-mass-destruction program.
Here is his Secretary of State Madeline Albright, also speaking in
1998:
Iraq is a long way from [the USA], but what happens there
matters a great deal here. For the risk that the leaders of a rogue
state will use nuclear, chemical, or biological weapons against us or
our allies is the greatest security threat we face.
Here is Sandy Berger, Clinton's National Security Adviser, who
chimed in at the same time with this flat-out assertion about Saddam:
He will use those weapons of mass destruction again, as
he has ten times since 1983.
Finally, Mr. Clinton's secretary of defense, William Cohen, was so
sure Saddam had stockpiles of WMD that he remained "absolutely
convinced" of it even after our failure to find them in the wake
of the invasion in March 2003.
Nancy Pelosi:
Saddam Hussein has been engaged in the development of
weapons-of-mass-destruction technology, which is a threat to
countries in the region, and he has made a mockery of the weapons
inspection process.
In a letter to the new president, a
group of senators led by Bob Graham declared:
There is no doubt that . . . Saddam Hussein has
invigorated his weapons programs. Reports indicate that biological,
chemical, and nuclear programs continue apace and may be back to
pre-Gulf war status. In addition, Saddam continues to redefine
delivery systems and is doubtless using the cover of a licit missile
program to develop longer-range missiles that will threaten the
United States and our allies.
Sen. Carl Levin also reaffirmed for Mr. Bush's benefit what he had
told Mr. Clinton some years earlier:
Saddam Hussein is a tyrant and a threat to the peace and
stability of the region. He has ignored the mandate of the United
Nations, and is building weapons of mass destruction and the means of
delivering them.
Senator Hillary Rodham Clinton agreed, speaking in October 2002:
In the four years since the inspectors left, intelligence
reports show that Saddam Hussein has worked to rebuild his chemical-
and biological-weapons stock, his missile-delivery capability, and
his nuclear program. He has also given aid, comfort, and sanctuary to
terrorists, including al-Qaeda members.
Senator Jay Rockefeller, vice chairman of the Senate Intelligence
Committee, agreed as well:
There is unmistakable evidence that Saddam Hussein is
working aggressively to develop nuclear weapons and will likely have
nuclear weapons within the next five years. . . . We also
should remember we have always underestimated the progress Saddam has
made in development of weapons of mass destruction.
Even more striking were the sentiments of Bush's opponents in his
two campaigns for the presidency. Thus Al Gore in September 2002:
We know that [Saddam] has stored secret supplies of
biological and chemical weapons throughout his country.
And here is Mr. Gore again, in that same year:
Iraq's search for weapons of mass destruction has proven
impossible to deter, and we should assume that it will continue for
as long as Saddam is in power.
Now to John Kerry, also speaking in 2002:
I will be voting to give the President of the United
States the authority to use force--if necessary--to disarm Saddam
Hussein because I believe that a deadly arsenal of weapons of mass
destruction in his hands is a real and grave threat to our security.
There's much more, but open your frickin eyes, people. This ain't a one-man show, there's just only been one man willing to stand in the spotlight that they all helped to turn on.
....much of this post blatantly stolen from http://www.opinionjournal.com/extra/?id=110007540
The internet is an excellent tool for researching the past. Web pages remain frozen in time at sites such as archive.org. Once things are out there, they STAY out there. Don't let CNN rewrite your history for you, remember it, and research it.
|
|
|
|
|
PR
 Big Ring Posts:172

 Registered Users Jackson County
 |
| 05/17/2008 7:01 AM |
|
I can only find two instances since WW2 when a president went against his national security advisory team: The Bay of Pigs, and the Invasion of Iraq. The morning we went in 18 of the 20 advisory reports (this is at the Whitehouse, in person) recommended that we not invade, and that the evidence for wmd's was not credible. We all know how many wmds we've found. |
|
|
|
|
G-MAN
 Big Ring Posts:148

 Registered Users Louisville, KY
 |
| 05/17/2008 10:23 AM |
|
Great post Big Tommy C, You might as well be talking to a brick wall...you would have better luck...the left doesn't care about fact, logic, reason, ect... All they know is feeling and they HATE Bush...end of story. |
|
|
|
|
OCguy
 Little Ring Posts:94

 Registered Users Oldham
 |
| 05/17/2008 10:35 AM |
|
| ...Much as the right hates anything Clinton. |
|
|
|
|
Big Tommy C
 Little Ring Posts:63

 Registered Users
 |
| 05/17/2008 11:56 AM |
|
That's completely different, though. Clinton is evil. |
|
|
|
|
OCguy
 Little Ring Posts:94

 Registered Users Oldham
 |
| 05/17/2008 4:35 PM |
|
| You must specify which, or both. |
|
|
|
|